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Buying Used Switched PDUs, Help in Choosing

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statewide_apc
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Buying Used Switched PDUs, Help in Choosing

This was originally posted on APC forums on 1/2/2008


Can you guys recommend a switched PDU that works great and needs to do what I need? I'm going to buy them on ebay used.

Features:
Multiple user logins (so each port/server has a different username/password to reboot their server)
All remote reboot ports are under one single IP Address, instead of having an IP per port.
Good plug and play (so I don't have to mess around with scripts etc) Web access for multiple users.

Also what exactly are the differences between the Masterswitch and the Masterswitch Plus?
Do they do the same thing?

Also do the 5-20 (on the 20A switched PDU) and 5-30 (on the 30A switched PDU) accept regular server cord plugs?
Also what about C13? Isn't C13 the same as 5-15?

I have a cabinet at a colocation facility that currently has 30Amp / 120V. The tech there says he thinks only 5-15 fits, but he's not sure. So I really need some help here to know if I can really indeed buy a switched PDU with 5-20 and 5-30 input plugs.

===
These model numbers I've seen on ebay for really inexpensive. But please let me know your experiences on each of these models, since I don't want to go out and buy a dud that doesn't work.

AP9225 with AP9606 NIC card. So I have to use an AP9224EXT in order for me to pool them together onto one IP? If I just buy four AP9225 units (with no EXT units), that would just take up four IP Addresses right? So that is an inexpensive way to go about it right?

AP9210
AP9211
AP9212
AP9222
AP9221

The AP700 - series are too expensive on ebay since those are newer models.

Do these old models have different methods of pooling together with 1 IP Address? Do all of them have multiple user login web interface capabillity? Also, again, can I buy models with 5-20 and 5-30 plugs, rather then just picking only from the 5-15 models?

Also there is a method for specifying that the remote reboot device FIRST conduct a soft reboot of the given server, and then if the server doesn't respond to that, THEN do a hard reboot. Because I would think a hard reboot everytime would damage the server.

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statewide_apc
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286

Buying Used Switched PDUs, Help in Choosing

This was originally posted on APC forums on 1/2/2008


Can you guys recommend a switched PDU that works great and needs to do what I need? I'm going to buy them on ebay used.

Features:
Multiple user logins (so each port/server has a different username/password to reboot their server)
All remote reboot ports are under one single IP Address, instead of having an IP per port.
Good plug and play (so I don't have to mess around with scripts etc) Web access for multiple users.

Also what exactly are the differences between the Masterswitch and the Masterswitch Plus?
Do they do the same thing?

Also do the 5-20 (on the 20A switched PDU) and 5-30 (on the 30A switched PDU) accept regular server cord plugs?
Also what about C13? Isn't C13 the same as 5-15?

I have a cabinet at a colocation facility that currently has 30Amp / 120V. The tech there says he thinks only 5-15 fits, but he's not sure. So I really need some help here to know if I can really indeed buy a switched PDU with 5-20 and 5-30 input plugs.

===
These model numbers I've seen on ebay for really inexpensive. But please let me know your experiences on each of these models, since I don't want to go out and buy a dud that doesn't work.

AP9225 with AP9606 NIC card. So I have to use an AP9224EXT in order for me to pool them together onto one IP? If I just buy four AP9225 units (with no EXT units), that would just take up four IP Addresses right? So that is an inexpensive way to go about it right?

AP9210
AP9211
AP9212
AP9222
AP9221

The AP700 - series are too expensive on ebay since those are newer models.

Do these old models have different methods of pooling together with 1 IP Address? Do all of them have multiple user login web interface capabillity? Also, again, can I buy models with 5-20 and 5-30 plugs, rather then just picking only from the 5-15 models?

Also there is a method for specifying that the remote reboot device FIRST conduct a soft reboot of the given server, and then if the server doesn't respond to that, THEN do a hard reboot. Because I would think a hard reboot everytime would damage the server.

See Answer In Context

13 Replies 13
BillP
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Re: Buying Used Switched PDUs, Help in Choosing

This reply was originally posted by n/a on APC forums on 1/3/2008


Did you know that instead of buying from Ebay, APC has a Factory Outlet Store that offers huge savings on many APC factory phase-out, overstocked and refurbished units?

Additionally if you purchase from the Factory Outlet Store all re-manufactured products are tested and come with a 90-day limited warranty-which I don't believe you would get if you purchased from Ebay.

Here is the link
http://buy.apc.com/commerce/storefronts/factoryoutlet/default.aspx?StorefrontCode=apcfo&CountryCode=...

Or you can find it on the "How to Buy-Visit the Factory Outlet Store" page

http://www.apc.com/buy/index.cfm

statewide_apc
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Re: Buying Used Switched PDUs, Help in Choosing

This was originally posted on APC forums on 1/2/2008


>
I'll just mention that most units have Outlet Users, which allows for individuals to have access to their own outlet, without having access to the rest of the switch. Login is still 1 at a time.


So for each pdu device (8 ports), only one user can login at any given time. But all 8 users would have different username/password variations even so, correct?

In the case of the AP9225 with 3 expansion units pooled, there's a total of 32 ports. For those 32 ports, only 1 user can login at any given time? Am I understanding this correctly?

>
Masterswitch Plus units are advised in situations where you need to reboot a server through a normal shutdown and not just cutting power/restoring power. (.....)
With the exception of the AP9225, all Masterswitch units will simply cut power and restore power. There delays that you can apply, but from the functional standpoint of the Masterswitch, they are simply powering off outlets. Only the AP9225 can send a shutdown signal to the server, which would cause a graceful shutdown, before power is lost.


I am wanting this graceful reboot since some dedicated server clients will just login to the remote reboot web interface and do a hard reboot (in cases when they could've easily used a graceful reboot). This is hard on the PSU and software on the server, I would think.
Is this dependent on the operating system installed on the server or does this work with all servers no matter what OS is installed on the server? We primarily are using CentOS Release 5 (Linux) on servers.

From researching online, I found out that 20A 5-20 plugs will fit in fine with regular 5-15 receptacles. But twist plugs (either 20A or 30A) will not fit properly into a 5-15 receptacle.

On the new AP7930 and AP7901 20Amp models, the output (plugs to the servers) is NEMA 5-20R which normal server plugs (5-15) go in there just fine. But the input (the main plug of the PDU device) is a 20A "twist" type plug NEMA L5-20P that does not connect to a 5-15 (regular) receptacle (wall jack).

Same with these AP7932 and AP7902 models, the NEMA 5-20R output receptacles are just fine with servers connecting to them. But the input (main plug to wall jack) is NEMA L5-30P which is 30A "twist" plug.

So both the 20A twist plug NEMA L5-20P and the 30A twist plug NEMA L5-30P do not plug into a 5-15 (normal) receptacle.

Does anyone know how these devices are used in a colocation facility environment? Perhaps I'm just unaware that colocation facilities have these twist receptacles? Although I had heard that at least some do not support the twist plugs / receptacles.

KVM4Life_apc
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Re: Buying Used Switched PDUs, Help in Choosing

This was originally posted on APC forums on 1/2/2008


quote
I'll just mention that most units have Outlet Users, which allows for individuals to have access to their own outlet, without having access to the rest of the switch. Login is still 1 at a time.


So for each pdu device (8 ports), only one user can login at any given time. But all 8 users would have different username/password variations even so, correct? Yes

In the case of the AP9225 with 3 expansion units pooled, there's a total of 32 ports. For those 32 ports, only 1 user can login at any given time? Am I understanding this correctly? Yes

quote
Masterswitch Plus units are advised in situations where you need to reboot a server through a normal shutdown and not just cutting power/restoring power. (.....)
With the exception of the AP9225, all Masterswitch units will simply cut power and restore power. There delays that you can apply, but from the functional standpoint of the Masterswitch, they are simply powering off outlets. Only the AP9225 can send a shutdown signal to the server, which would cause a graceful shutdown, before power is lost.


I am wanting this graceful reboot since some dedicated server clients will just login to the remote reboot web interface and do a hard reboot (in cases when they could've easily used a graceful reboot). This is hard on the PSU and software on the server, I would think.
Is this dependent on the operating system installed on the server or does this work with all servers no matter what OS is installed on the server? We primarily are using CentOS Release 5 (Linux) on servers. Only the Masterswitch Plus (AP9225) can send perform a graceful shutdown, meaning when you gracefully reboot an outlet, the server (connected through a serial cable to the AP9225) receives a shutdown signal, the server then shuts down, the outlet then cuts power. This way, the server shuts down properly.

From researching online, I found out that 20A 5-20 plugs will fit in fine with regular 5-15 receptacles. But twist plugs (either 20A or 30A) will not fit properly into a 5-15 receptacle. NEMA 5-20 outlets with "T" outlets can house either a 5-15 or 5-20 input plug. You can't simply plug a 5-20 into a 5-15 receptacle.

On the new AP7930 and AP7901 20Amp models, the output (plugs to the servers) is NEMA 5-20R which normal server plugs (5-15) go in there just fine. But the input (the main plug of the PDU device) is a 20A "twist" type plug NEMA L5-20P that does not connect to a 5-15 (regular) receptacle (wall jack). Correct, these two units have locking inputs but the outputs are "T" connects, so you can use either a NEMA 5-15 or 5-20 non locking plug.

Same with these AP7932 and AP7902 models, the NEMA 5-20R output receptacles are just fine with servers connecting to them. But the input (main plug to wall jack) is NEMA L5-30P which is 30A "twist" plug.

So both the 20A twist plug NEMA L5-20P and the 30A twist plug NEMA L5-30P do not plug into a 5-15 (normal) receptacle. Correct, from an input standpoint you need to use the required plug. The amperage that these PDU's can support would overload a 15 amp circuit so you need to make sure that the circuit you're plugging into can support the PDU and potential load.

Does anyone know how these devices are used in a colocation facility environment? Perhaps I'm just unaware that colocation facilities have these twist receptacles? Although I had heard that at least some do not support the twist plugs / receptacles. I'll let other people comment on this.

statewide_apc
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Re: Buying Used Switched PDUs, Help in Choosing

This was originally posted on APC forums on 1/3/2008


I'm having trouble finding the AP9225EXT on ebay. I can find lots of AP9225 though. Can I use four total AP9225 units together? Or I have to use 1 AP9225 and 3 AP9225EXT?

statewide_apc
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Re: Buying Used Switched PDUs, Help in Choosing

This was originally posted on APC forums on 1/3/2008


In the AP9225 manual, I wanted to read how it would be supporting graceful reboot. But I noticed that there has to be software installed on each server in order for graceful reboot to work? Or am I understanding this wrong? What software is this exactly?
From the manual:

1. Connect the power cord of each device to an outlet on the back
panel of the unit.
2. To use the Graceful Shutdown and Graceful Reboot features of the
unit:
a. Make sure that each connected server is running PowerChute
Network Shutdown.
b. Connect the basic-signaling cable (not provided) of each server
to the corresponding Basic port on the front panel of the unit.
For example, a server plugged into outlet #3 must be connected
to Basic port #3. The table on page 5 lists some basic-signaling
cables supported by the unit.
3. Connect the supplied cascade cable (940-1000) to the To UPS port
of each unit and to the Advanced port of the succeeding unit, as
shown in “Typical cascaded configuration (on-demand)” on this
page.

statewide_apc
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Re: Buying Used Switched PDUs, Help in Choosing

This was originally posted on APC forums on 1/3/2008


I saw this in the APC remanufactured area. AP9510515 It says its a switched pdu, but I'm not sure about this one. It only has two plugins... so this is basically like a mini switched pdu? Does this support multiple user login on the web interface? Or is this just some kind of power outlet?

TheNotoriousKMP_apc
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Re: Buying Used Switched PDUs, Help in Choosing

This was originally posted on APC forums on 1/4/2008


This is just a power outlet, or additional 2 two outlets for the use of 1. It does not have any remote manageability.

KVM4Life_apc
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Re: Buying Used Switched PDUs, Help in Choosing

This was originally posted on APC forums on 1/4/2008


Correct, you would use this part (AP9510515) in conjunction with a Masterswitch/MasterswitchPlus/Switched Rack PDU.

The AP9510515 is basically a switchbox. The outlets are powered by utility power, but the box itself is powered by the Masterswitch. If you reboot the outlet that the AP9510515 is plugged into, it turns off the box, which in turn cuts power to the outlets.

These units are designed for high amperage loads to be powered by a lesser amperage Masterswitch. ie. 5000 VA load connected to AP9225 (total capacity is 1800 VA). Since the Masterswitch is not actually powering the load, you can plug in higher loads and still control their power remotely.

KVM4Life_apc
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Re: Buying Used Switched PDUs, Help in Choosing

This was originally posted on APC forums on 1/4/2008


To answer your other questions, the AP9225EXP is basically just the AP9225 minus the web card. So, you could technically purchase (4) AP9225's, remove the web cards from three of them, and manage the outlets from one IP address.

"In the AP9225 manual, I wanted to read how it would be supporting graceful reboot. But I noticed that there has to be software installed on each server in order for graceful reboot to work? Or am I understanding this wrong? What software is this exactly? *Yes, each server needs to use either Powerchute Business Edition or the Native Shutdown Utility (commonly found in Windows NT servers and higher). You also need to have the serial cable connected between the server and the serial port on the Masterswitch. For Windows machines the serial cable part number is 940-0020.*
From the manual:

1. Connect the power cord of each device to an outlet on the back
panel of the unit.
2. To use the Graceful Shutdown and Graceful Reboot features of the
unit:
a. Make sure that each connected server is running PowerChute
Network Shutdown.
b. Connect the basic-signaling cable (not provided) of each server
to the corresponding Basic port on the front panel of the unit.
For example, a server plugged into outlet #3 must be connected
to Basic port #3. The table on page 5 lists some basic-signaling
cables supported by the unit.
3. Connect the supplied cascade cable (940-1000) to the To UPS port
of each unit and to the Advanced port of the succeeding unit, as
shown in “Typical cascaded configuration (on-demand)” on this
page.

afterhours_apc
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Re: Buying Used Switched PDUs, Help in Choosing

This was originally posted on APC forums on 1/14/2008


I would stay away from anything with the 9606 card in it. We've had three, and over time they would become deaf -- no graceful way to reset them to regain access to the firmware and make them functional again. Not via the network nor their windows-only wizard software. The techs I have spoken with have told me on several occasions that 'this happens' and I have no recourse.

I like APC products, but I'm really disappointed with the three 9211/9606 devices we can only use as shiny extension cords now. Really sucks. Had hoped it was as simple as replacing a clock battery and doing a reset, but apparently that isn't how the firmware was engineered. Paperweights.

That said and due to the situation, we risked another APC purchase with a 7900. That device has served very well over the last year or so.

We are an APC reseller, so it was frustrating to find ourselves in this position.

The 7900s have the features you seek.

Message was edited by: afterhours

KVM4Life_apc
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Re: Buying Used Switched PDUs, Help in Choosing

This was originally posted on APC forums on 1/15/2008


I'm surprised that you had that many problems with the AP9606 card. How old were the units that failed and did the tech supp reps provide any further details other than what you described?

statewide_apc
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Re: Buying Used Switched PDUs, Help in Choosing

This was originally posted on APC forums on 6/4/2008


KVM4Life, what is the AP9221NX166 and how is it different from the AP9221 with AP9606? Or are these the same? I can't find any info online anywhere because they were discontinued.

statewide_apc
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287

Buying Used Switched PDUs, Help in Choosing

This was originally posted on APC forums on 1/2/2008


Can you guys recommend a switched PDU that works great and needs to do what I need? I'm going to buy them on ebay used.

Features:
Multiple user logins (so each port/server has a different username/password to reboot their server)
All remote reboot ports are under one single IP Address, instead of having an IP per port.
Good plug and play (so I don't have to mess around with scripts etc) Web access for multiple users.

Also what exactly are the differences between the Masterswitch and the Masterswitch Plus?
Do they do the same thing?

Also do the 5-20 (on the 20A switched PDU) and 5-30 (on the 30A switched PDU) accept regular server cord plugs?
Also what about C13? Isn't C13 the same as 5-15?

I have a cabinet at a colocation facility that currently has 30Amp / 120V. The tech there says he thinks only 5-15 fits, but he's not sure. So I really need some help here to know if I can really indeed buy a switched PDU with 5-20 and 5-30 input plugs.

===
These model numbers I've seen on ebay for really inexpensive. But please let me know your experiences on each of these models, since I don't want to go out and buy a dud that doesn't work.

AP9225 with AP9606 NIC card. So I have to use an AP9224EXT in order for me to pool them together onto one IP? If I just buy four AP9225 units (with no EXT units), that would just take up four IP Addresses right? So that is an inexpensive way to go about it right?

AP9210
AP9211
AP9212
AP9222
AP9221

The AP700 - series are too expensive on ebay since those are newer models.

Do these old models have different methods of pooling together with 1 IP Address? Do all of them have multiple user login web interface capabillity? Also, again, can I buy models with 5-20 and 5-30 plugs, rather then just picking only from the 5-15 models?

Also there is a method for specifying that the remote reboot device FIRST conduct a soft reboot of the given server, and then if the server doesn't respond to that, THEN do a hard reboot. Because I would think a hard reboot everytime would damage the server.